- Posts: 881
- Joined: Tue Jul 15, 2014 10:50 pm
Wed Apr 29, 2015 1:32 pm
"I guess having a degree in planning makes me see things a little differently to the amateurs on this forum."
Is one of your sins arrogance?
I'm going to risk being called a hypocrite after raising this question mind. Because I don't hold graduates of "planning" or "architecture" all that highly when it comes to discussing urban development in the round. On technical issues, certainly. These are, after all, vocational degrees in many respects. I'd trust a planning graduate on the ins and outs of S106, planning appeals processes, etc. I'd trust an architect and the engineers he/she works with on the design of safe, functional and attractive buildings and public spaces.
I may even go as far as to say these groups have a particular appreciation of what "good urban design" is. But I don't think we should defer to these groups on discussions and decisions on development more generally. Why?
Well, because I think degrees in planning or architecture do make people see things in different ways, and not always for the better (so perhaps you weren't being arrogant). It leads to an over-focus on "good design", and too little focus on practical and economic realities. Its an approach that doesn't recognise that buildings and urban spaces need to be designed and delivered in a way that is economical. And there is often something of a Sim City syndrome - this idea that the authorities can plan developments in a way that isn't possible in a market economy like the UK's.
So in this case, I will admit that it would be great to have a bus station which all services travelling to/from or via the city centre drop off and pick up at, which is located next to the train station. But I also think its great to have High St and the top 2/3 or St Mary's street pedestrianised, creating a nice environment for outdoor cafes, coffee shops, open air events and markets, etc.
Now given that St Mary's street is pedestrianised, given where most bus users get on and off (which has never been the bus station), and given the need to maintain decent journey times to keep buses as attractive as possible, its not feasible or indeed desirable to have all buses pick up and drop off at a bus station located at central square.
This means the current bus station is far too big given its current use. Given it is also unsightly, and helps create a bad first impression for the city, it should clearly go. And the new facility should be somewhat smaller, so as to not take up more space than required. But it should include some capacity for additional services to serve new suburbs (although note that as with existing services most people using these services won't be wanting to travel to the central bus station/train station).
The question is then one of location. Should it be right in front of the station as it is now? Or should it be about the same distance, but off to the right? Here I think I'll say there is not only an economic reason, but also one of urban design, for the latter. Bus stations are not that attractive to look at - with large areas of tarmac, a clutter of vehicles, people hanging around. Better to have it nearby but slightly tucked out the way - so it isn't the first thing people see (although it should be very clearly signposted) and doesn't get in the way of the majority of people who will want to leave the station on foot. By moving it we can create a nice public space, and something of a landmark building, to greet people as they leave the station.
And finally the question is how should building be phased? Again it would be ideal if the new station could be up and running before the old one was closed. But for reasons outlined already, I don't think that is economically possible. It would risk the development of the key site in Cardiff, and perhaps Wales.
Having to travel an extra hundred metres from bus to train or vice versa while a new bus station is built may be somewhat inconvenient, especially for those with disabilities. But it doesn't seem a gamechanger: its not as if the buses will be starting the other side of the city. And the existing bus station is not well designed - again, especially for disabled people. It might actually actually be easier to catch a bus from the rear of the station, or from Wood Street or Westgate Street than trying to navigate the various bus shelters of the station.
Is one of your sins arrogance?
I'm going to risk being called a hypocrite after raising this question mind. Because I don't hold graduates of "planning" or "architecture" all that highly when it comes to discussing urban development in the round. On technical issues, certainly. These are, after all, vocational degrees in many respects. I'd trust a planning graduate on the ins and outs of S106, planning appeals processes, etc. I'd trust an architect and the engineers he/she works with on the design of safe, functional and attractive buildings and public spaces.
I may even go as far as to say these groups have a particular appreciation of what "good urban design" is. But I don't think we should defer to these groups on discussions and decisions on development more generally. Why?
Well, because I think degrees in planning or architecture do make people see things in different ways, and not always for the better (so perhaps you weren't being arrogant). It leads to an over-focus on "good design", and too little focus on practical and economic realities. Its an approach that doesn't recognise that buildings and urban spaces need to be designed and delivered in a way that is economical. And there is often something of a Sim City syndrome - this idea that the authorities can plan developments in a way that isn't possible in a market economy like the UK's.
So in this case, I will admit that it would be great to have a bus station which all services travelling to/from or via the city centre drop off and pick up at, which is located next to the train station. But I also think its great to have High St and the top 2/3 or St Mary's street pedestrianised, creating a nice environment for outdoor cafes, coffee shops, open air events and markets, etc.
Now given that St Mary's street is pedestrianised, given where most bus users get on and off (which has never been the bus station), and given the need to maintain decent journey times to keep buses as attractive as possible, its not feasible or indeed desirable to have all buses pick up and drop off at a bus station located at central square.
This means the current bus station is far too big given its current use. Given it is also unsightly, and helps create a bad first impression for the city, it should clearly go. And the new facility should be somewhat smaller, so as to not take up more space than required. But it should include some capacity for additional services to serve new suburbs (although note that as with existing services most people using these services won't be wanting to travel to the central bus station/train station).
The question is then one of location. Should it be right in front of the station as it is now? Or should it be about the same distance, but off to the right? Here I think I'll say there is not only an economic reason, but also one of urban design, for the latter. Bus stations are not that attractive to look at - with large areas of tarmac, a clutter of vehicles, people hanging around. Better to have it nearby but slightly tucked out the way - so it isn't the first thing people see (although it should be very clearly signposted) and doesn't get in the way of the majority of people who will want to leave the station on foot. By moving it we can create a nice public space, and something of a landmark building, to greet people as they leave the station.
And finally the question is how should building be phased? Again it would be ideal if the new station could be up and running before the old one was closed. But for reasons outlined already, I don't think that is economically possible. It would risk the development of the key site in Cardiff, and perhaps Wales.
Having to travel an extra hundred metres from bus to train or vice versa while a new bus station is built may be somewhat inconvenient, especially for those with disabilities. But it doesn't seem a gamechanger: its not as if the buses will be starting the other side of the city. And the existing bus station is not well designed - again, especially for disabled people. It might actually actually be easier to catch a bus from the rear of the station, or from Wood Street or Westgate Street than trying to navigate the various bus shelters of the station.
