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Plasdwr - 6,000 Homes

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RandomComment

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Re: Plasdwr - 6,000 Homes

PostWed Jan 22, 2020 12:20 pm

Frank wrote:Interesting article on the BBC website:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-51179688

What is the purpose of the modern build designs? Is it really so great for cars? I don't see how all the bendy roads make it that easy and the place seems designed for people to get lost in.


I think developers use bendy roads for two reasons:
1) Is to slow traffic down in order to make it seem quieter and safer. Long straight roads to encourage more speedy driving.
2) To give a sense of place/enclosure. Having roads that bend means that views are closed off - and people tend to like a mix of open and closed views.

There can be a trade off with making new estates as walkable as possible. But its not as bad as it was in the 80s, 90s and early 2000s when cul-de-sacs were very much the norm. Just compare the road layout of say Danescourt (80s) with Radyr Sidings (late 2000s, early 2010s). The latter has roads that bend back and forth a little bit, but none of the cul-de sacs - which in Danescourt mean homes can be hundreds of metres apart on foot, even if they are adjacent as the crow flies. Or compare the Broadlands estate (early 2000s) with the Coity estate (2010s) in Bridgend and you see a similar thing.

So my view is things have improved a fair bit - even if they could go further. I think some academic urban planners, architects, etc., are a bit disconnected from the real world as well.
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Msmurf

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Re: Plasdwr - 6,000 Homes

PostWed Jan 22, 2020 3:19 pm

I think you have missed a key point - developers are trying to maximise profits by maximising population density while minimising infrastructure costs. IMHO this would be better served by building low-rise appartment blocks in brownfield areas served by public transport rather than tiny starter homes on greenfield commuter estates.
Build it and they will come.
Get it wrong and they will fall off.
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cardiffian

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Re: Plasdwr - 6,000 Homes

PostWed Jan 22, 2020 4:48 pm

Seriously how hard is it the Cardiff Council to look at a map of inner cardiff, or any other popular inner city area in Europe or even the US. What do they have in common? Walkable streets ! The designs of the new hosing areas around cardiff are absolute wank. Full of deadends and no through roads. No wonder there are no local shops anymore.
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Re: Plasdwr - 6,000 Homes

PostWed Jan 22, 2020 7:41 pm

cardiffian wrote:Seriously how hard is it the Cardiff Council to look at a map of inner cardiff, or any other popular inner city area in Europe or even the US. What do they have in common? Walkable streets ! The designs of the new hosing areas around cardiff are absolute wank. Full of deadends and no through roads. No wonder there are no local shops anymore.


As I said, I think there has been progress on this when you look at the newest estates. Although some of these (like Radyr sidings) are in pockets of land that its very hard to have lots of external linkages to/from, within them they are avoiding the deadends that were so ubiquitous in the 80s, 90s and early 2000s.
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Re: Plasdwr - 6,000 Homes

PostWed Jan 22, 2020 7:44 pm

Msmurf wrote:I think you have missed a key point - developers are trying to maximise profits by maximising population density while minimising infrastructure costs. IMHO this would be better served by building low-rise appartment blocks in brownfield areas served by public transport rather than tiny starter homes on greenfield commuter estates.


If this was the case, surely the profit-hungry developers would be doing it, especially given brownfield brownie points.
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Msmurf

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Re: Plasdwr - 6,000 Homes

PostTue Jul 21, 2020 10:57 am

I have been looking through the Masterplan and it seems that the tram/train network was just added as an afterthought. The Masterplan should have been developed around the network!

The existing plan takes the tram off the existing alignment and meanders through the development which just delays the journey times to Creigiau and the west. For no apparent benefit as only two stops are envisaged - at Plasdwr West which is on the existing alignment - and Plasdwr East which is only just north of the existing alignment. A small diversion to the north would facilitate this without taking the circuitous route to the South.

Public transport should include an integrated circular bus service through the development to feed the two tram stops
Build it and they will come.
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Simon__200

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Re: Plasdwr - 6,000 Homes

PostThu Jul 23, 2020 10:41 am

Msmurf wrote:I have been looking through the Masterplan and it seems that the tram/train network was just added as an afterthought. The Masterplan should have been developed around the network!

The existing plan takes the tram off the existing alignment and meanders through the development which just delays the journey times to Creigiau and the west. For no apparent benefit as only two stops are envisaged - at Plasdwr West which is on the existing alignment - and Plasdwr East which is only just north of the existing alignment. A small diversion to the north would facilitate this without taking the circuitous route to the South.

Public transport should include an integrated circular bus service through the development to feed the two tram stops

I made this point nearly 3 years ago.

Simon__200 wrote:It doesn't matter if it's behind schedule or if it takes longer than planned. The point is that if the local authority was serious about their Metro project, they'd have made provisions *before* embarking on new housing estates, not ignore it, with a view to possibly making a half-arsed attempt at crowbarring some compromise into place in the future when they get around to it.

What does this say about the attitude to The Metro project if they can plan a huge housing development to the west of the city near St. Fagans, but not bother even considering any plans for reopening a line that's already effectively there, let alone planning anything new?
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Simon_SW17

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Re: Plasdwr - 6,000 Homes

PostThu Jul 23, 2020 2:33 pm

The line should absolutely have been part of the planning permission for Plasdwr, however we're at a stage where the project has just been awarded £565,000 to progress and the original route is protected throughout the development. Cardiff and RCT councils are fully behind the building of the line so things could be a lot worse.

Obviously the houses are being built now so time is of the essence.
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